she’s green
Borrowing from shoegaze while carving out a sound distinctly their own, self-described “moss music” purveyors of Minneapolis she’s green haven’t slowed down since their formation. Their new EP, “swallowtail,” arrives July 10 as the follow-up to 2025’s “chrysalis” — together revealing a band capable of far more than the dreamy, fuzz-soaked sound they first became known for. Next week, the band heads out on a U.S. tour with Turnover and Narrow Head before crossing over to Europe in August and September.
Recently, vocalist Zofia Smith and guitarist Liam Armstrong joined me to discuss the past, present and future of a band that rarely stands still.
Listen to this interview anywhere podcasts are available.
The following transcript was generated using transcription software and may contain minor errors or omissions.
YY: I guess I'll start with the EP. You've been releasing music since about I believe it's 2022. In that time there have been two EPs and we now have a third on the way. But as I understand it, "swallowtail" is actually the second half of a full length album with the last EP. Is that right?
LA: Yeah, it was kind of like a double EP project. We kind of concepted.
YY: Okay, and so given the titles "chrysalis," "swallowtail," I'm sensing a sort of like metamorphosis theme. How much thought went into deciding what material you would put on "chrysalis" versus "swallowtail?"
LA: I mean, honestly, it was just the time, the timing of everything. I think we definitely did have some internal battles with like which songs we were trying to save for "swallowtail" and which ones we were going to put on "chrysalis." There's one song specifically that's coming on "swallowtail" called "close your eyes" that we've kind of had for a long time. And yeah, I think we were just kind of like it came to an ultimate decision of like, which songs we wanted to live track with Sonny and like which ones we kind of just already had mostly done. And those were the ones that ended up on "chrysalis."
ZS: So yeah, we knew we would have the resources just to kind of like live track as a band for this second half. So some of those specifically were like, okay, when we play these live, they just feel different and like, we really want the listener to like get the live feel from it. So I think that was like a big thing for us, like wanting it to sound like, you know, we're really playing these together right now because we have like a pretty distinct live show. I think they're pretty different than the recordings. Like we're a little bit heavier. Yeah, so we wanted some of those just to like really have that push and live feel. I think that's the biggest difference. Yeah.
YY: Okay. Have you noticed like a different response when you're playing songs from the EP live versus, you know, some of your older stuff?
LA: That's a good question.
ZS: Yeah, I mean, there's been a lot of people, you know, saying like, wow, I really love the direction that this is going. Specifically "mettle," people get really excited about that one because it's a bit heavier and it has like more dynamics. And then we also have another song we've only played once, I think in Chicago. Oh, we also played it in China, but there is a softer song that's more vocal forward and you know, a little like less rhythm section and it's more on the emotional side. But I think people have also really loved that. So I think I think getting like the dynamic ups and downs of everything people have appreciated because I think our like our older stuff has more of like a similar sound to itself. So the fact that we're like, we're switching it up for some of the new songs, I think people are like a bit surprised in a good way.
YY: Good. You mentioned one of your new songs being a little more vocal forward than some of your older stuff. To my ear, both your newer singles sort of have that more vocal forward quality to them. Is there any truth to that or am I just hearing things?
ZS: Yeah, I think so, for sure. Sonny Diperri specifically was like, let's not hide your vocals. Like, this is really good stuff. And I've been really into the Sundays and they're like, they have a little bit of shoegaze elements. I wouldn't call them a shoegaze band. But I think we're trying to like lean more into that side of things a little bit.
YY: I think it was Alternative Press who said recently in like a write up of one of your songs that one of the unspoken rules of shoegaze is that the vocals aren't as audible or something, which like, okay, sure. Yeah. Would you consider yourselves a shoegaze band or would you prefer to like, distance yourself from that label?
LA: Yeah. Definitely. Like, we don't want to get pigeonholed into like one specific genre, but we do love shoegaze and I don't even think like vocals being buried is necessarily like indicative of shoegaze. A lot of shoegaze bands I love don't do that. So. But yeah, I feel like we borrow textural tendencies from the genre for sure.
ZS: Yeah. Like we're very inspired by shoegaze, but I think honestly, like we're, yeah, we don't want to be like forced into that. And we're just, we're just kind of doing our own thing, honestly.
YY: And I think of those two singles that I was mentioning, when it comes to vocals sort of being buried, unless people are reading along with the lyrics, I feel like they might miss some of the themes and both of these new singles, they have these very clear messages that — I guess people can go and read about them — but do you often strive to channel a very distinct theme in your songwriting, or, I guess, when it comes to writing the lyrics, or were these two songs just sort of unique?
ZS: Yeah, I would say I often put myself like in an environment or a scene and, and I think that's why our music kind of channels like very cinematically because we love movies and scenery. And for me, that's why our band is like very nature based. Like I kind of picture myself in, you know, this gorgeous environment in the woods or on the beach. And specifically there's a song you're like, okay, we're on the beach. So I've been kind of just like trying to envision an environment and really like create a scene with these new songs specifically. And that's why I think it is like it is a bit more important that, you know, you can hear what's going on.
YY: Yeah. And you mentioned nature briefly. I know you guys have talked about just the band's love of nature in the past, so I won't be too exhaustive here, but it seems almost core to who you are as a band, these sort of nature or like almost pastoral themes. When you're on the road, do you make a conscious effort to sort of get out and experience other parts of the world?
LA: Yeah, definitely. I mean that's just part of, I think for us just not taking anything for granted. And like we, we're so thankful to be able to like, go to all these cities and like, see most of the country that like we've never seen before. And like we just went to Sequoia the last time we played or went through Fresno.
ZS: So yeah, that was like the best day ever. We had, we had a full day off and we're like, we have to go to Sequoia. We had a lot of fun. We, we went to a waterfall. I think one of other places have been like Ithaca. There's a bunch of waterfalls And yeah, I love to just right over there and, you know, journal and the West Coast is also amazing. I really love the redwoods and yeah.
YY: So do you write actually in nature, you like immerse yourself and write?
LA: Yeah. When we're at home, like we usually just go out to a river or something and just hang out for a while with acoustic guitars and it helps us break away from the kind of like hustle bustle of the city.
YY: Would you guys ever like — I mean, because that's really interesting. It's obviously, you know, very different to what the final product is going to sound like, but would you ever consider doing something more acoustic or is it something you've ever wanted to do?
LA: Definitely. Yeah.
ZS: Yeah. There's a song on there that is very acoustic. But I think we're, we're trying to do more of that just because like that is very central for us. Like that is where it usually starts. So I think it just like some of them, you know, we want to just be like the most raw with it and honest. And I think in the, in the past and like, sometimes we do really feel like, you know, the effects really enhances the emotions and the feel of the song, but not all the time. Sometimes I think, you know, it's almost better, and you feel more the more intimate and raw it is. We're going to definitely be doing more of that.
LA: Yeah. It's kind of easy to lose yourself in a lot of like the kind of like "wall of sound" stuff. And then, but also it's like there's value in kind of listening to like someone just sing and play guitar and then kind of letting like your mind fill the gaps. So yeah, there's like two different kind of sides.
YY: Yeah. I think people would be really interested to hear where some of these songs started and maybe a little surprised to hear, you know, how different that they would sound. But I said something about touring very briefly — after your "wisteriaW EP in 2023, you didn't release any new music for almost two years, but you were playing a lot and I imagine writing a good deal as well. What do you think was your biggest development as a group during that time?
ZS: That's tough. Honestly, like I think a lot of people like to think that we're like super busy, but we really just had like a bunch of shows here at home and we had like weekend shows up and we were all like, still going to school or half of us. So honestly, we're like grinding out school and we were all like working and pretty busy, honestly. And then like the feedback that we got from "wisteria," we were like, oh my god, like, maybe we should start dedicating more time to this. And so that was a big turning point. Like, I think that's just when we started to feel encouraged to, to do more and, and to practice. And I think, like all of the people wanting us to play those shows, like we're pushing us to write more. And and then once, you know, school ended and we wrote "chrysalis" and then we right after writing "chrysalis," we did like our first US tour. So that was like the big moment for us was, was the being done with school and going on our US tour.
YY: Sounds like a cathartic experience.
ZS: Yeah.
YY: But I also wanted to just draw attention to the fact that you guys have been a support act for a long time. You spent about ten days opening for Bad Suns last month. Coming up this month, you'll support Chapterhouse and then you're going to be opening for Turnover and Narrow Head in June and July. Just like big stuff. I haven't even mentioned your festival dates that are coming up. So, you know, you've spent a few years now as this really strong opening act. What do you think you've learned in that role? And then when are we going to see another headline tour?
LA: In the fall. I don't know when it'll be.
ZS: Yeah, it's coming up. Be on the lookout. We're super excited. It's been so cool because there's such a variety of bands that we've been opening for. Like Blonde Shell and Bad Sons. They're like, you know, they're different than like Slow Crush and there's some like heavier bands. And so it's cool to see like their interactions with the crowd and just like the different types of people coming out. And yeah, honestly, I'm just really excited to have our own like setup and like design and team and it'll be cool to see who comes out.
LA: Yeah, we, I feel like we're learning so much about like stage setups and kind of like the best way to go about touring.
ZS: And sound — that's a big thing. A ton of the acts have had in-ears. And we're kind of just like figuring all of that out.
YY: Is it interesting seeing the differences between like, you know, because you still play a fair amount of shows? Just you guys, you mentioned like some shows at home. Is it interesting to see sort of who comes out for the people you're supporting compared to, you know, the shows that you headline?
ZS: It is interesting. I mean, sometimes you can like really tell like, oh, they're here for us. Other times, like, it's really hard to tell. Like when we were opening for Glixen our fans like were pretty, pretty similar. Yeah. But with some of like the pop artists we tend to have a little bit of like, like an emo vibe. Yeah. With our fans. So we're like, oh, they're kind of emo. They're probably here for us. Like, I don't know. I wouldn't have expected that. But it's interesting.
LA: Yeah. And then like, it's also a little terrifying getting up to play in front of a bunch of people where, you know, it's like, nobody's really here for you.
ZS: Yeah, we can spot that right away.
LA: But definitely like a cool experience to just like be showing your music to people that have never really heard it. So.
ZS: Yeah. Like I'm like on trial. I have to like win them over in some way. And I like the challenge.
YY: Totally. Have you seen people actually get won over? Like not really into it in the beginning. And then by the end they're like, okay, I'll stick around for this.
LA: Yeah. It's fun to hear people come up to us and be like, yeah, you guys are so amazing. I've never, never heard of you guys before. So.
ZS: Or even sometimes they'll be like certain people I keep an eye on the whole time because they're just kind of like sticking, you know, that straight face the entire time. And then I'll be at the merch table and they'll be like, you're amazing. That was amazing. I was like, wow, I really thought you hated us. But you never know.
YY: I'm unfortunately one of those people. Even if I'm really enjoying something, I probably won't express it too much. And that must be hard. You know, when a lot of people in the audience look like that.
LA: Oh, yeah. I totally get it. I'm like that.
ZS: Yeah, yeah. I mean, we've like, gotten used to it now to the point where like we're, you know, there's just people are different.
YY: Sure. And, you know, I mentioned your festival appearances very briefly, and you're talking about sort of enjoying the challenge of trying to win people over. I would imagine that festival sets are sort of that way a lot. But then you have the added complications of, okay, this is also way different from, you know, our standard live set, you know, and you guys have played festivals before, but you're about to go and play like some really big ones. What are your typical challenges? What do you foresee happening? What do you like sort of thinking about that you're going to have to deal with at these next festival sets?
ZS: Yeah, that's a tough question.
LA: Yeah.
ZS: Because I would imagine there would also be a lot of people that are like, who is this? You know, they're just waiting for the next band or, you know, whatever the case is. But I can't really see anything like bad necessarily happening. I mean, there's always like audio things that could happen. Sure.
LA: Yeah. I guess just like making a good impression and then also trying to see all the artists that I want to see at the festival, too. Yeah. But yeah, I mean, festivals are always so fun and they're like, they have like, I feel like less of a, less of an intense vibe just because they're usually outside or like slide away might be different because it's like indoors and I don't know.
ZS: Yeah. Are we outside? Do you know anything about that?
LA: We might be outside. I don't know.
ZS: I really love an outdoor show, I think. Yeah. Like I'm just like, instantly, like in a better mood. So I feel like, yeah, changeover can be complicated. But I'm pretty sure they're back lining, so it should be all good, but I hope the crowds are all very nice. I don't know, last time we went and played in the UK, they were so amazing. Like everybody was just like so sweet and into it. And it felt like honestly, like home, like it was very homey. Everybody is just like so welcoming. So I'm curious if the festival vibe is different than the small club vibe.
YY: I would hope not. I've been to my fair share of of festivals, and I think people are typically like more open minded, you know, because they're sort of ready to see bands.
ZS: Yeah, they're just there to have fun.
YY: Yeah. And the UK is obviously a very different experience from the US, which is also a very different experience from places in Asia. You mentioned that headline tour you played in China earlier this year, which was I believe it was sold out. Right? It was three shows and they were sold out.
LA: Yeah, it was very close.
ZS: I think it was like a few tickets away on two of them. But the second one was sold out in Shanghai.
YY: How did that experience differ for you guys from something that you might play like at home in Minneapolis or even, you know, in the UK?
LA: It was insane. I feel like we didn't we were not expecting we were like expecting to go over there and play for like eight, ten people and then just having like 3 to 400 people show up.
ZS: I think there was like 500.
LA: Yeah, 500 people, and we're just like, how do they, how do these people even know about our music?
ZS: Yeah, because they have different streaming. So we had no idea what to expect. We're like, I don't, I don't know where they would have possibly found us over there.
LA: Everybody's got the internet.
ZS: I know, I mean, we're like, you guys use Instagram? Yeah, RedNote is huge. So we got a RedNote. But yeah, we were getting recognized, which was really awesome.
LA: Yeah. I don't know if it was just the scale of everything, but it just kind of felt like we were more popular over there than we are here, which is just wild. But yeah, it was a super wonderful experience.
ZS: Yeah. We've never had the experience where we're going out after soundcheck to like go have a bite to eat and then there's a long line already and we're walking past them and I was like, oh my god, they were like taking videos of us, that has never happened to us before. So the fact that we're in China right now, and I don't know. So it was a surreal experience.
YY: I was very surprised just to see that you guys were playing over there. But I guess, you know, there's a reason — you have the support, so that's really cool.
ZS: Yeah, that was awesome.
YY: And just while we're talking of touring, I know that can be difficult. And especially with the frequency that you're that you're doing it now, every band is different in this way, but how do you maintain like collective sanity with like such an increasingly busier tour schedule? Do you have outlets that you explore other than nature, I guess?
LA: Definitely just like taking downtime for each of us. And like, you know, I mean, like Rains and Teddy are on vacation right now, so, and we just kind of had like a little —
ZS: Like a bachelor party in New Orleans. But while we're on tour specifically, like, I really like to just have alone time with whatever book I'm reading. I'm just like, okay, I gotta lock in. And I'm been like, only reading books that are written by women. And I think that really helps me because I'm around men all day. So I'm just like, I need to hear another woman speak. But that, and also just going on walks and like trying out different food those little moments of like, wow, I'm in a different state. I just like, want to see what's around me right now and, and take that all in. And that personally helps me stay sane.
YY: Wrapping it all up, you guys have so much coming up. What are you most excited about? And then what are you maybe a little anxious for?
ZS: I feel like those go together, but I am the most excited about just like the headline stuff. We have a Europe tour coming as well, and I think that I'm a little nervous about how we're going to be perceived over there, just because some bands that we know are like saying that the crowds are a little bit tougher over there. So I think it just depends because some people are loved more and some people are less popular. So I think I'm the most anxious and excited about Europe.
LA: Yeah, it's kind of boring, but I'm thinking I'm the most anxious about all the logistics of just like getting around and like, oh my god, like, how are we going to get there and get all this stuff there?
ZS: Yeah.
LA: But I'm so excited to be on tour and also to get these songs out.
YY: I'm sure you guys probably have quite a bit in the queue.
LA: Yeah, we would really like, I mean, I'm also super excited to just sit down and write an album.
ZS: Yeah.
